In this months edition of The Business Monthly, Mark Smith wrote an excellent article about the Turf Valley grocery store controversy and the resultant petition drive to overturn CB58. CB58 amends the Planned Golf Course Community (PGCC) zoning to allow the developer to build a 55,000 square foot grocery store instead an 18,000 square foot grocery store. What many people don’t realize is that this legislation does more than that.
“The legislation limited the size of any other store in the development to 20,000 square feet and added reforestation rules that had not applied to the commercial site.But if the legislation is erased due to the possible referendum (which would allow county residents who live far away from Turf Valley to vote for or against the wishes of local residents), it all goes away, as would the limitation on the other potential uses, such as big box retail.”
Interesting.
The petition gatherer who approached me back in December told me the petition was to keep more big box stores out of Howard County. I wonder how many people would have signed the petition if they had known that it if CB58 were overturned if could actually result in more big box stores in the county.
Daily
17 hours ago
15 comments:
This is difficult to buy into.
The developer is the guy who's concerned about adding trees and limiting big box stores? Or is it someone else?
To the most ardent 55sqft grocery proponents: What about the surrounding businesses? A lengthy study was done by Oekos prior to purchasing the Waverly center in 2007, and they never would have gotten in had this 55sqft change occurred before their deal.
To you chamber types, what about this other company? I genuinely cannot figure out how you'd look the other way when this Oekos company has invested dozens of millions in HC, is a mid-atlantic regional company and is based here.
What about this company? How can you dismiss this? Also, the Oekos research says that the empty grocery (for years?) at St. Johns and 40 shows the market for large grocery stores is not good when they are too close together.
The Oekos research is very specific. Honestly, why are they dismissed out of hand?
Anon,
It is interesting, I never hear the "save the Weiss" reason for signing the petition. Often times, the line is "help keep big box out of Howard County," or the "spot zoning" misrepresentation. If this really was about the detrimental effects on the Waverly Woods shopping center, why isn't that stated as the reason and the only reason? Why all the logical fallacies? The hyperbole? Why not just be honest with people?
Santos,
The irony abounds when the misrepresenter accuses others of misrepresentation. Very effective, sometimes. Otherwise you wouldn't keep doing it.
I've kept track of the referendum progress and have never heard anyone claim what you're stating.
Anon,
Please check your resources on this issue. The reference to big box stores has been well documented on this blog. With respect to spot zoning, Marc Norman circulated an email in December stating such. Check with Marc, I'm sure he will verify that he sent out the email.
Let's set the record straight with the following documented facts:
1. Oekos invested $26M in the Waverly shopping center after conducting extensive research and noting that the Turf Valley developer had voluntarily removed their 2004 Comp zoning request to increase the 18,000 sqft grocery store limit.
2. There are at least 6 grocery stores within 3 miles of Turf Valley. If the 55,000 sqft increase is approved, the Waverly Weis anchor will absolutely fail. While some small stores have already closed in Waverly (due to the current economic climate), this will force the remaining stores out of business. The 1,000+ Waverly homes will then depreciate due to the near vacant shopping center in their community.
3. Big box has never been part of the discussion points circulated by Howard County Citizens for Open Government.
4. The only Planned Golf Course Community (PGCC) zoned property in Howard County is Turf Valley, owned by the Mangione family. CB58/ZRA 100 changes the PGCC text and therefore ONLY benefits one property owner. This is a textbook definition of spot zoning.
5. Because ZRA 100 was a text amendment (titled Greenberg Gibbons Commercial), the Turf Valley property was NEVER posted and 99% of the area residents NEVER knew about the proposal until after the Planning Board had approved it.
6. The Chamber of Commerce publishes its legislative positions annually. They have consistently advocated for "predictability" and urged the government not to take actions that help or hurt one property owner over another.
7. The Turf Valley GM, Peter Mangione, is on the Chamber's Executive Board. Is it possible that the Chamber's general membership was manipulated by the leadership's efforts to support Turf Valley?
8. Richard Talkin is representing Brian Gibbons and Greenberg Gibbons in their lawsuit against the Howard County and State Boards of Election. They have alleged BoE incompetancy, voter fraud, perjury, and forgery in their recent court filings.
9. In addition to refusing comment to press inquiries, the developer and their attorneys have provided absolutely NO documentation to support or corroborate their very serious allegations.
10. Howard County has been forced to hire outside counsel to defend the lawsuit. During an economic crises, this is diverting (wasting) taxpayer money from important programs such as infrastructure, education, police and social services.
anon 10:34,
Thank you for those poignant facts.
Facts?
"If the 55,000 sqft increase is approved, the Waverly Weis anchor will absolutely fail."
Speculation.
"99% of the area residents NEVER knew about the proposal until after the Planning Board had approved it."
Wild conjecture.
"Howard County has been forced to hire outside counsel to defend the lawsuit. During an economic crises, this is diverting (wasting) taxpayer money from important programs such as infrastructure, education, police and social services."
Opinion.
Opinions, speculation and conjectures are not facts.
-wb
wb,
well said.
WB,
This is probably a good time to ask which developers sponsor your work as a commercial real estate broker. Your posts have an obvious agenda and your readers deserve full disclosure.
Anon 12:00,
There's no secret. wordbones is Dennis Lane at Ryan Commercial. His LinkedIn profile is located at http://www.linkedin.com/pub/6/6a/4b7
He's been working with commercial development in Howard County for 30 years.
Anon 12:00 AM,
Everyone has an agenda.
Anon 1:47 AM,
I am first and foremost a citizen of Howard County.
-wb
wb - since you have experience in commercial real estate, can you help answer 2 questions?
what is the definition of a big box and would big box stores find the turf valley golf course to be an attractive location with adequate households and road infrastructure?
Word Bones,
Do you have an answer for ANON's question about Turf Valley? You must be familiar with these real estate issues.
Anon 9:30 PM,
In order to properly answer that question I need two things. First, I would need to conduct a feasibility study of the site and that would require someone to engage me. Two, I would need to know who the hell I am talking to besides "anon 11:25 AM".
If you wish to engage my professional services, drop me an email and I'd be happy to discuss terms.
-wb
Come on Dennis, that's a cop out. You've had very strong opinions about Turf Valley for months. You know the area and have the ICSC data. Go out on a limb with an opinion....
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